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So you don’t vote and theirs counts even more? I’m not saying the odds aren’t stacked against you here, but your predecessors probably weren’t singing a defeatist tone due to this when it was their turn. The electoral college absolutely must burn. Letting the people benefitting from it run the country probably won’t help with that, though.

What, annoyed an ML is arguing common fucking sense? Ruining your accelerationist vibes? Sorry that I fucking despise Americans and their stupid ass choices. Guess that makes me a lib, then, for not wanting a modern Hitler as a neighbor.

This is literally elections 101 dude. You vote, someone votes against you, there’s 2 votes and theyre tied. You don’t vote, someone still votes against you, that’s one vote against you and none for you and you just lost. That is the literal scenario presented when you’re learning how to vote.

If you’re telling me you’re not voting because you’re going to bomb the Capitol and white house, or begin a revolution on election day, hey be my guest, but the truth is youll just stay home, letting others vote against you. I guess I expected too much out of you to understand such a simple concept.

You were there, stop bullshitting. Quote where I denied the genocide, let’s see it. What I did say was to get your head out of your ass and vote. Genocide denial is what’s going on with you guys, only putting the dems on a magnifying glass while the other party plans resorts in Gaza.

Genocide isn’t “the one thing”, it is the last straw on the back of a very tired camel. There is no longer a single political issue where the democrats have yet to show themselves to be actively detrimental.

I’m sorry but I don’t get it. The genocide hasnt stopped, its probably gotten worse, Trump ran to attack Iran after every other president in my entire life had turned down Israel. How is anything better right now vs when dems hold any sort of power and just pretend they can’t do shit? Like I also get how fucking stupid their spineless are, but on this specific issue, both sides are virtually the same? So why make this the issue that decides everything else? Trump has directly made my country worse by very directly interfering with our elections and pardoning our drug lord president. He’s emboldened the far right around the entire world, he’s turned corporate America into the owners of the world, tripled the price of gas in less than a year, and is about to throw us into the deep end of a worldwide depression. The cracks were there but this motherfucker is pushing with all he has to break things, and the genocide is still happening in the background. I truly, sincerely don’t get it.

The majority of palestinians died under Biden. Things did not get worse, you just did not have to pretend to care. In actuality the Palestinian cause is the first one to create any actual progress in the fascist duopoly of the United States. AIPAC is radioactive, psychos like you have to, at the very least, pay lip-service towards the ongoing genocide instead of denying the evidence seen by your own eyes.

My eyes have been paying close attention since October 7th. Do not make the mistake of assuming my identity just because I am arguing for voting. I am American, because I live in the continent of America, but I am not a US citizen. I am Honduran, living in Honduras, watching this madness unfold and unable to do shit about it. I cannot vote in the empire’s games, I simply take it in the ass when you make the wrong choice. You’ve all been making the wrong choice for at least the past decade (definitely longer), and we’re all paying for it.

You people somehow demand everything is solved immediately if people dare to suggest an alternative to voting for genocidal fascists, yet any critique of the genocidal fascists get dismissed with vague platitudes about slowing things down for some promised day when things will change. How do you think change comes, if not by the focused efforts of people working towards it?! This asinine insistance on entrenching a mass-murdering status quo that you types keep arguing for is deranged. It makes no sense

What makes no sense is arguing anything else for election day. You just go out and vote for not trump, for anything that makes trump and his base lose power. Its not as hard or as immoral as you make it out to be. What makes no sense is that you all argue this, then the fascists become MORE empowered, ad infinitum. You’re essentially arguing for accelerationism, hoping that this mess eventually breaks people into revolution, or in similar words to yours, dismissing my arguments with vague platitudes about speeding things up for the worse, for some promised day when things will change. We’re both probably arguing out of the devices built to prevent that from happening. Things are just going to get worse, but at least you won’t have voted for “the genocidal party”, right?

You could do all you say, organizing, pushing, resisting, fighting. You insist on doing nothing instead, and in the exact planned moment when the bullies pull out the rulebook and decide your actions, or rather lack thereof, give them more power rather than less. Then your actions, your voice, your presence shrinks by the power of the law of the land. But at least you didn’t vote for the genocidal party.

No you don’t, you won’t even acknowledge the degree of the Democrats crimes

Well from where I’m standing its you guys who don’t acknowledge the degree of the GOP (and Trump) crimes. Like I see the hole on the ship but I’m a bit more worried about the other ship that put a hole into ours, still there, visibly loading up more slugs.

Well there were two years to work that out.

And there’s going to be another 2 years after this where more can be done, but only if people don’t vote for more fascism in this one.

Maybe you should have done that some time in the last decade then

I was a bit too busy being from a third world country to do anything about it, sorry.

Lol

Lol indeed

So its going to the definitely-not-genocidal definitely-not-israel-loving goblins at the GOP? Because any choice other than Dems, including abstinence, is a vote for GOP and Trump. It’s virtually coded into the electoral college.

Like I get hating the dems, but Jesus Christ there’s king donkey kong over there, behind them, climbing the fucking empire state while holding an underage princess (and a fuck ton of redactions) in his hand.

p -> q

Every time I hear people talking about “punishing the Democrats”, I see the full-on fascists growing in power shortly afterwards. You punished Hillary for sabotaging Bernie, Biden for being too geriatric, and Biden and Kamala for outright skipping the primaries. What happened in every scenario? The most morally bankrupt person we know just waltzed into power and started doing whatever the fuck he wanted, with some resistance at first, and then with ecstatic embrace. Are we really so eager to pave the accelerationist’s road?

Edit: oh hey I just realized it’s you from the other post on /c/USA. I got banned from that community for our little discussion. Had a reply for you and all. Hope you have a great November 3rd (or whenever elections are). I sure as shit won’t.

Yes, but also, the timing is always dangerous. Let’s removed about it all however much we want, but let’s not fall for the thought trap of growing disenfranchised from the voting process, however rigged it may be. Whatever argument you have against the system, we all have to admit that Trump winning the first time was not something even the establishment expected. If they can do surprises, so can we. Their biggest trick is to make you think your vote doesn’t matter when it so clearly does, even when the electoral college is stacked against it. The electoral college wouldn’t be so dearly protected if your vote didn’t matter.

… Not that I’m saying you personally hold these views, but I’ve seen them around enough that I feel the need to voice my thoughts as well.

I totally understand feeling slimy as fuck being forced to vote for people like that. I don’t know what alternatives there are for the upcoming month other than just sucking up and going through with the voting. That doesn’t mean you’re sacrificing your morality or values by playing the game for election day. Just for those days, you play their game to try and claw some voice back. Every other day we must force them to play our game. We aren’t, we maybe can’t right now, but we can’t also let them play us on the few days we’re forced to engage them on their turf. Elections are the civic duty you go through as part of your social contract, but that’s not where our true fight lies. That’s how I see it at least; its a moment to hold the line, voice some sort of opinion, limited though it may be. It may be the only thing allowing you to organize in the future without being labeled a terrorist for your dissenting opinions.